ILLUSTRATORS' Q & A

[Dustin Adams]

Just remember that one of their big criteria is telling a story with your art, not just showing a character or a scene.

This is awesome. (Cred to Soul too, he mentioned this above)

This must be why there's little ships flying around on Orson Scott Card's Ender books. Otherwise we just have a boring space station being static.

I'm now thinking up a change for my book cover, which I now realize has this very problem. No story.

D

[soulmirror]

And I know I've mentioned it before, but I always thought it might be another advantage and angle to play (and why shouldn't forum folks hear whatever advantage or angle there may (or may not, it's just imo) be?

I figured if telling a story is a plus ... then maybe coming up with a TITLE that puts a story or a dramatic content in the judges' minds is a plus, too. Or makes an ironic or comedic little point about the illustration ... (since we have to give it a title anyway) ???

Here's a few portfolios of past IOTF winners:
http://iof25.com/?q=maingallery

Look at the picture, then look at the TITLES. How often does the TITLE add to the image's impact, do you think? A LOT. With the ones without titles ... do you wish there WERE a title?

Imo, this one of mine works about twice as well, simply because the TITLE tells you something about what's going on ...
http://iof25.com/sites/default/files/people/Scott/gallery/No-Angel-Falls-Today%21-sepia.jpg

[Pat R Steiner]

Don't be worried about digital.

Of our judges and guest speakers--most of them work digitally. Yes, some do their concept sketches with pen/pencil but the pros work under tight deadlines and digital is fast and allows for instaneous changes that will no doubt be required by their clients. Of these judges, Stephen Martiniere's stuff is almost all digital. He walked us through his process--too cool! (Now Stephen Hickman is the opposite. He follows in the footsteps of the Old Masters when it comes to technique. Man, that man is fixated upon perfection.)

As for the winners this year when it comes to process:

Me--pencil and then scanned to Photoshop and tweaked to get that darker vibe.
Emily Grandin--ink pen and scanned.
John Haverty--ink pen and photographed (his stuff is too big for scanners.)
Fiona Meng--some ink, some digital
Mago Huang--watercolor and oil?
Paul Pederson--mostly digital
Grag Opalinsky--oil
Carly Trowbridge--ink and watercolor
Hunter Bonyun--digital
Jay Richard--digital
Rhiannon Taylor--digital
The elusive J. F. SMith--oil

I think almost everyone tweaks their stuff on Photoshop or Painter.

As to how to win the contest: Stick to your strengths. Be original. Use your art knowledge and skills--composition, technique, etc. And yeah, tell a story. I really really tried to do that with my stuff. (Although some of the finalists work was portraits and cool images.) Come up with funny cool titles. It can't hurt. I think that also helped me get a win. In the end they're looking for someone whose work is right there at the edge of pro-level, if not already there.

You could go to this year's winners' sites to see what they're putting out. (As well as the link Scott mentioned for past winners. I can't wait to see the coffee table book!) I have links to this year's winners' sites on my site. (Although I don't think the one to Jay's is working at the moment?)

[soulmirror]

Great and helpful insights there for everyone, Pat!

I luv your whole website. This part is especially cool, where you take us step-by-step to see how you developed your anthology illustration!

(And imo your #28 illustration there is wonderful!)

http://patsteiner.com/2012/04/18/my-illustration-process/

[soulmirror]

Just remember that one of their big criteria is telling a story with your art, not just showing a character or a scene.

True that. Anyone visiting the deviantart site can see a vast array of well-rendered dragons and orcs, robots and spaceships ... but not so many images that "stick" in your memory. The "telling a story" aspect Martin suggests is definitely important (and the workshop instructor artists said as much)

[Imagination Vortex]

Ok so I've been thinking about what my next submission should be for the Illustrator contest. Since I've had no luck with photographs and photoshop, I thought I'd try doing actual illustrations. But I had some questions on how to go about submitting them. The rules say that you can't submit anything greater than 9 x 12. But I wanted to work with a much larger canvas and then submit a 9 x 12 copy. So I wanted to know what some good options are for scaling down a larger work and submitting it to the contest.

I think the easiest solution would be to just take it some place and have them scan it and print it out smaller. I've never been to these places so I wanted to know how much does this cost? I guess I was trying to avoid having to pay, especially if it is expensive to do this.

I also thought about taking it in to have it scanned as a 9 x 12 jpg image and then submit it that way, if it is cheaper then printing it out. Unfortunately I'm worried that I'll have the same problem that I did with my other submissions, which is how to make sure it's no less then 300 dpi and 5mb.

The only other solution I can come up with is taking a picture of the art with a digital camera. But I've done this in the past and have had problems with the image being blurry or the colors are washed out and not as vibrant. Then of course I'd still have the problem with the 5mb file size minimum requirement.

So I wondered if anyone can tell me what the best way to submit is, and how I can turn out top quality for a low price. Thanks!

[soulmirror]

I'm so low-tech I'm afraid I can't offer much advice. I got away with it because I did (mostly) b&w line art (few greytones) and scanned two halves of the original artwork/drawing ... joined the halves in Photoshop ... and printed out (or, Heaven forgive me, Staples xerox'd) the contest copy to send USPS hardcopy.

Primitive oldschool moves, those ...

I'd just take the big original art to a copy shop that has a big flatbed scanner, tell them the contest size/file requirements, and see what happens. No idea of cost, but if it's above $5 I'd be surprised. But I dunno.

I've tried to photograph art before ... and doing THAT is an art/tech skill I've never succeeded at, results were always lousy. Many painters have pro's do theirs, I've heard.

So ... sorry to be zero help, but I'd suggest your own idea: find a big scanner and have them do it. I never e-submitted ART ... but I'd consider that now if I could. That way, each judge sees the equivalent of the original submission, brilliant colour on their own screen ... rather than a beat up copy with coffee stains ???

[Imagination Vortex]

I'm so low-tech I'm afraid I can't offer much advice. I got away with it because I did (mostly) b&w line art (few greytones) and scanned two halves of the original artwork/drawing ... joined the halves in Photoshop ... and printed out (or, Heaven forgive me, Staples xerox'd) the contest copy to send USPS hardcopy.

Primitive oldschool moves, those ...

I'd just take the big original art to a copy shop that has a big flatbed scanner, tell them the contest size/file requirements, and see what happens. No idea of cost, but if it's above $5 I'd be surprised. But I dunno.

I've tried to photograph art before ... and doing THAT is an art/tech skill I've never succeeded at, results were always lousy. Many painters have pro's do theirs, I've heard.

So ... sorry to be zero help, but I'd suggest your own idea: find a big scanner and have them do it. I never e-submitted ART ... but I'd consider that now if I could. That way, each judge sees the equivalent of the original submission, brilliant colour on their own screen ... rather than a beat up copy with coffee stains ???

That is interesting, I never thought about scanning parts of the picture and putting it together in photoshop. I did try to scan something once using the scanner in my house, however it didn't come out very good. But it was a simple pencil drawing, and when it was scanned you could barely see the pencil lines. Still I will try it first and see how it comes out. If it doesn't work I will take it to a place and get it done. If it's really under 5 dollars an image that shouldn't be too bad. I thought it was going to be way higher which is why I was concerned and wanted to figure out a way to do it for free. Also it's good to know I'm not the only one who has had problems with trying to photograph art. I guess that option is out completely. Still, thank you for the insights, they were helpful! Right now I won't worry too much about it and just make the art, because that is the most important!

[jose77sanchez]

Hello fellow illustrators,

I am also an artist and am new to your forum and out of curiosity, does anyone have an idea as to the number of art entries that come in to the contest on an average quarterly basis?...
I realize that it probably fluctuates-but there should be maybe a general ball-park figure floating around somewhere ?...I'd like to know what kind of competition we face-not just on a national- but global level as well, since it is a world-wide phenomenon! I had posed this question previously in another section, but it seems that most of the people there were mostly writers and they suggested that I contact other artists that would know better...

Thanks!

[soulmirror]

Hi. It's a question that puzzles Writers and Illustrators both, and pretty much it's forever a mystery. The Contest keeps it mysterious ... but the common answer would be "thousands" (and getting bigger every quarter)

It's commonly believed that there are more Writers in the contest, than Illustrators.

There is wisdom elsewhere about which quarters are more heavily entered than others ... I'd suggest that everyone simply commit to entering every quarter they can!

You'll get better everytime you enter.
You'll burn thru your comfortable ideas (and ones the judges see many times) and so move on to challenging/daring ideas.
You'll lose to the competition one or more, this or that, times ... but enter dutifully and you'll be there to win it if the competition ever skips entering a quarter.

There's alot of info for Illustrators here: search out the info! Keep trying! They change up the artist judges, so one judge's tastes may luv you and one may not (I got both on non-winning finalist critiques)

Ask questions, here and of yourself!

[Imagination Vortex]

I just thought of a question. So everyone knows that David Farland judges the stories every quarter. But does anyone know who the judge of the art is? Does it change every quarter? Is there a way to find out who it is going to be before you enter? I was just wondering because if the judge is never the same, then technically it would be possible to enter the same art you entered in a previous quarter. Maybe it would appeal to one judge over another.

I ask because once Joni told me in an email that I could use 2 previous images and pick a new one for the 3rd image. She said the possiblities are endless. So I thought maybe this meant that the judge is always different and might have different tastes than a previous judge. So if this is true is there a way to know judge is going to be?

[soulmirror]

It's a good question, afraid I don't know the answer, myself. Does anyone here know? I'd like to hear how it goes, myself!

The one time I got written non-winning Finalist feedback, there were three/four art judges who had scored my art and also written comments along with a point-by-point scoring list -- maybe ten, fifteen points? Creativity, technical ability, use of medium, etc? Then one judge gives you a 9, one gives you an 9 ... and one gives you a 4 all on the same points! The same thing two gave you luv on ... the third rails against.

And that's a time Joni calls and says "It was soooooo close" and I'm thinking to myself: the one judge probably cost me a win, on things the other two liked? But that's as much luck and timing as any other contest variable ... "This was the quarter when the genius-contestants stacked up, versus the next quarter when the competion wasn't so great, and the same art would've won etc ... so ... ENTER EVERY QUARTER!

Which isn't complaining, it's me suggesting your question is dead on ... it'd be great to know which judges are looking at your art. After all, the WRITERS get some ideas (alot of ideas) about how David Farland looks at things ... but who can predict the judges?

WRITERS: When you get feedback, is it only from Mr. Farland, or do others critique you too?

But like I said, the one time I got Finalist feedback (the next time I got no feedback, the third time I won so the feedback is at the workshop), it came from three judges: two "huge name" artists (well, three because one was a husband-and-wife team whose work I've adored since I was ten, and one who I suddenly realized I'd luv'd his book covers but didn't know his name) ... and one judge, the Hater Judge I'd never heard of.

May all your judges be blissed-out artist hippies!

[jose77sanchez]

Thank you soul mirror and Imagination Vortex!
Very insightful information into the process of (ahem) "judging our work". I knew that there were many judges in the roster-but had no clue that they were actually rotated so often. I guess that this could be potentially a good thing since-yeah tech merit, quality of art-etc.,etc, but they are human beings just like everyone else, so they have "tastes"and these will always vary-from person to person. So, this may always help to give us an edge from quarter to quarter.I had been taking a much needed break during mid March since I hadn't stopped cranking out large and detailed artwork since the middle of last year...waiting now for April, to get my boots on and start hitting it again. Don't know, but generally speaking, I tend to be optimistic for the most part...

[jose77sanchez]

Ok so I've been thinking about what my next submission should be for the Illustrator contest. Since I've had no luck with photographs and photoshop, I thought I'd try doing actual illustrations. But I had some questions on how to go about submitting them. The rules say that you can't submit anything greater than 9 x 12. But I wanted to work with a much larger canvas and then submit a 9 x 12 copy. So I wanted to know what some good options are for scaling down a larger work and submitting it to the contest.

I think the easiest solution would be to just take it some place and have them scan it and print it out smaller. I've never been to these places so I wanted to know how much does this cost? I guess I was trying to avoid having to pay, especially if it is expensive to do this.

I also thought about taking it in to have it scanned as a 9 x 12 jpg image and then submit it that way, if it is cheaper then printing it out. Unfortunately I'm worried that I'll have the same problem that I did with my other submissions, which is how to make sure it's no less then 300 dpi and 5mb.

The only other solution I can come up with is taking a picture of the art with a digital camera. But I've done this in the past and have had problems with the image being blurry or the colors are washed out and not as vibrant. Then of course I'd still have the problem with the 5mb file size minimum requirement.

So I wondered if anyone can tell me what the best way to submit is, and how I can turn out top quality for a low price. Thanks!

I tend to work in large format purposefully and then reduce my original into individual parts-but my technique tends to be a mix of "old and new" school. So far, it has worked for me-and maybe it could help you as well.What I do is if you are familiar with Kinko's ( that's FedEx Office-they usually tend to have the most up to date equipment. I place my original directly onto the glass with the top open and copy it into parts-reducing each part-ex: a 22"x28" into approx 4 parts ( that's about 37-40% for each part using legal size paper-8.5"x14".The resolution on these color copiers ( they're using CANON brand now ), is very high-so the quality is outstanding and each copy is relatively inexpensive- I think they're like 53 cents + tax right now.
Then I cut carefully around each image part using a steel ruler and xacto knife with blade # 11 or just use a regular paper cutter-do not recommend scissors-unless you have "nerves of steel." Then I tape them all together by the back side with invisible scotch tape. Now, I make another copy of that directly onto the glass but I now use card stock at this phase of the process, since the quality of the image comes out superior to the regular laser paper that you initially used at the beginning. Finally,scan and work with it in Photoshop-if necessary to digitally erase any "connector lines" that might show through, although from my experience, if you cut very carefully at the start, you can get a really good result and not even have to resort to digitally fixing it.
Good luck.

[Stephen Stanley]

Ron Lindahn is the coordinating judge for IotF. This position does not rotate. Ron also runs the workshop along with his wife Val. Ron picks the finalists. The judges (usually three) who decide the winners do rotate each quarter.

You can resubmit an illustration that has not received a semifinalist critique. Once an entry of three is given a semifinalist critique all three are "disqualified" from future submission. I would often resubmit an illustration from a rejected batch. However, I won with three NEW illustrations. I advise artists to create new work for each submission. You never know which of the three rejected illustrations the judge considered the "weakest."

Make sure all three entries are strong. You will be judged on all three. Even if you have one outstanding illustration, if the other two are weak you will not place or win. I often ran out of time near the end of a quarter (especially during the quarters I entered both contests) and my last drawing was too rushed.

IotF is a little different than WotF in that the semifinalists are actually the finalists that do not win. (WotF has separate semifinalists and finalists, with the finalists that do not win still eligible for publication in the anthology — both the semifinalists and the finalists stories that do not win are no longer eligible for re-entry.) A little trivia from me: I was an IotF semifinalist twice in the year I won WotF: I came that close to winning both contests in the same year.

As far as the number of entries per quarter, this last bit of information is totally unscientific: I was a semifinalist four or so times. On each of my critiques was a number specifying my entry, cataloging it anonymously. That number was never larger than the high double digits. Make of that what you will. If other entrants/winners can supply more information, please do.

Enuff from me,

Stephen

[jose77sanchez]

Stephen,

That's great and the same thing happens to me! I thought I was the only one.
Most of the time I work so hard on my first two art entries ( and usually more on the first than on the second ), that by the time I get to the third-I barely have enough time to finish it and so have to rush it or use something I have lying around from the past. Examples can include older sketches that for some reason or another, I never fully developed or a "re-made" image from the past also qualifies. This is usually an existing picture that I actually go and re-do. In many cases, it usually turns out better than the original and I am finally pleased with it-so it no longer haunts me.
The last part of the 2012 quarter, I wasn't able to submit, since I had still been hard at work on an illo that was supposed to be completed-but didn't get to finish it until the beginning of 2013! and this whopper took me four months to complete-so I'd say I had skipped two quarters because of it-and only until now in 2013, was I finally able to add on 2 newer entries along with it! Finally-it left me a little "fried", so I'm waiting for the beginning of April to start up again.

[jose77sanchez]

Oops!

[jose77sanchez]

[quote][/quote]
Re: ILLUSTRATORS' Q & A
by Dustin Adams » Fri Apr 20, 2012 1:52 pm

Just remember that one of their big criteria is telling a story with your art, not just showing a character or a scene.
This is awesome. (Cred to Soul too, he mentioned this above)

This must be why there's little ships flying around on Orson Scott Card's Ender books. Otherwise we just have a boring space station being static.

I'm now thinking up a change for my book cover, which I now realize has this very problem. No story.

D5x HM
V28 Q3: Finalist
Dustin Adams

Posts: 785
Joined: Thu Oct 27, 2011 11:47 am
Location: NY, state of
Private messageE-mail Dustin AdamsWebsite


Dustin, I've also noticed that a way to tell a story with your art, involves a lot of times some sort of indication of movement or animation in your artwork-plus the title helps a great deal as well.Title goes a long way in summarizing what your picture is all about and movement helps it reach a dynamic element-even an impact feeling of emotion can come out of it!

[jose77sanchez]

Ron Lindahn is the coordinating judge for IotF. This position does not rotate. Ron also runs the workshop along with his wife Val. Ron picks the finalists. The judges (usually three) who decide the winners do rotate each quarter.

You can resubmit an illustration that has not received a semifinalist critique. Once an entry of three is given a semifinalist critique all three are "disqualified" from future submission. I would often resubmit an illustration from a rejected batch. However, I won with three NEW illustrations. I advise artists to create new work for each submission. You never know which of the three rejected illustrations the judge considered the "weakest."

Make sure all three entries are strong. You will be judged on all three. Even if you have one outstanding illustration, if the other two are weak you will not place or win. I often ran out of time near the end of a quarter (especially during the quarters I entered both contests) and my last drawing was too rushed.

IotF is a little different than WotF in that the semifinalists are actually the finalists that do not win. (WotF has separate semifinalists and finalists, with the finalists that do not win still eligible for publication in the anthology — both the semifinalists and the finalists stories that do not win are no longer eligible for re-entry.) A little trivia from me: I was an IotF semifinalist twice in the year I won WotF: I came that close to winning both contests in the same year.

As far as the number of entries per quarter, this last bit of information is totally unscientific: I was a semifinalist four or so times. On each of my critiques was a number specifying my entry, cataloging it anonymously. That number was never larger than the high double digits. Make of that what you will. If other entrants/winners can supply more information, please do.

Enuff from me,

Stephen

You may be correct when you said that all 3 images are judged equally-but I don't think that it's fair that just because the other 2 are not as strong as the first "outstanding" picture, that you should be disqualified.I have been doing artwork for a long time and I always try to outdo myself on each entry, but at least from my experience, I've noticed that no matter how hard you try to get all images to an "outstanding" level, that there will always be the greatest, just as good but not greatest and then there's the weakest of the group-being the last one-of course, not necessarily in that order-but it does usually turn out that way-at least for me it has and I don't only work in one medium-I try anything anmd everything that will reach the final result that I'm looking for. I've even sent in a mix of black and white and color images not just on different pictures but also each image I'll sometimes combine b&w AND color on the same illustration.

[soulmirror]

You have to remember that the contest is looking at your three entries in order to imagine how "good" the artist's FUTURE, UNSEEN story illustration may be (the one they'll use to illustrate a winning story) ...

They know EXACTLY what the winning STORY will be (They choose the best story entry). They can only GUESS (via your three contest submission) how your future illustration will look.

So I suppose they are judging us by both Successful elements of the entries ... but also seeing "warning signs" of future problems that may appear in their book's illustration. One "great" illustration will rightfully be dragged down if the other two show "warning signs" of artistic problems.

I've seen enough comparison between "These are the illustrations that WON someone the contest" versus "Here's what appeared in the WOTF illustrating a winning story" to see:

Sometimes the actual WOTF book's art isn't the same high quality that the three contest winners promised.

Pressure? Or maybe the artist is great at illustrating PEOPLE ... but the winning story only has ROBOTS in it to work with? There could be many reasons ...

But imo you gotta submit THREE BEST art entries ... not one that's your best and then two "fillers"

And there's a choice to be made between focusing on the ONE thing or theme you illustrate best ... versus demonstrating you can do a VARIETY of subjects and themes?

[soulmirror]

Who here enters the Illustrators contest? Roll call! :) Sound off!

Anyone? Any remaining "double-threats" to win both contestses? (I'm afraid I'm pretty much the infrequent writer-entryest now, assuming I ever even had a shot at the two-fer)

If not ... c'mon, contest Writers, help the bruthah'sistuh contest out and spread the news to your illustrator friends to enter!

I'm just sayin' ... !!!

http://www.kings.cam.ac.uk/files/archives/03-12-a-big.jpg

[Aria Adams]

I'm a double-threat

Or will be, when I finish them and actually start participating...

[Imagination Vortex]

I plan on becoming a double-threat...someday...

It's hard for me to write and submit 3 pictures every quarter. I seem to be focusing more on writing these days, but once I win I know I'll be back at it submitting to the illustrators!

[soulmirror]

Yay to you Illustrators Contest and artists! The more the merrier!

And it's the illustrations that make our WOTF / IOTF anthology extra (extra!) special as both a contest AND a book upon the shelves (or digital devices) imo!

And double threats are the best threats! :) (Are they not THREE, the double-contest winners, yes?) You or you or you or YOU could be the 4th!

Certainly it's fairplay to concentrate on one contest at a time!

[Imagination Vortex]

Ok I've been trying to think of a way to ask this question without making it confusing, but I've been thinking about this so much that I feel like I'm not even making sense to myself! I'm probably over thinking this, but if I'm right, it could explain why my art was rejected when I entered years ago.

Ok here is my question. Under the contest rules it states the image can be a maximum size of 8.5 x 11. I had assumed that the 8.5 was length and the 11 was width. However, in photoshop the options are HEIGHT and width. Does this mean that the height is the length, and the width is still the width? Am I even getting the 2 values right in the first place? I ask this because I realized something. If 8.5 is the height and 11 is the width, that would give you a rectangle. But if your art is published, the book is taller then it is wider, meaning either your picture would end up sideways, or the height would become 11 and the width would become 8.5. I just finished a picture and had this problem, and all my other pictures in the past were longer then they were taller. So maybe I'm getting the values wrong? I'm trying to remember back to the ceremony when they show you the artists and their 3 winning pictures, and I don't remember any that were being wider then they were taller. So have I been looking at this the wrong way all this time? I hope this even made any sense! Maybe I should try a lame attempt at drawing a picture...

Should I stop making pictures that look like this I_____I <---8.5

And start making pictures that look like this

I I
I I
I_I
^
^
8.5

(Okay that was a pathetic attempt but I'm hoping someone can decipher my nonsense!)

[Imagination Vortex]

Ok I knew that later on I was going to realize how complicated I made things, when the question was simple!
What I'm trying to ask is - should the 8.5 x 11 be landscape or portrait? Silly me.

[Stephen Stanley]

For entering the contest it does NOT matter the dimensions of your original art. What the contest is requesting is that your artwork be presented at a size that will fit on an 8.5" x 11" rectangle.

Your original art can be landscape, portrait, round or square, as long as your submission fits on 8.5 x 11. If you work digitally this is not a problem: you just save a file reduced to fit on this size. If you work traditionally, you'll either scan or photograph your original, then size the scanned or photographed digital image to the size requirement.

If you win the contest, when you are assigned a manuscript to illustrate for publication you will be given size requirements.

I hope this helps.

Stephen

[Imagination Vortex]

Thank you so much Stephen! I guess I was fretting over nothing! It's been a while, but I've started to think about entering the illustrators again. So I appreciate you taking the time to help answer my question!

[soulmirror]

Well ... it may indeed BE so quiet here on the IOTF side of things that you could hear the crickets chirp ... But we're sci-fi and fantasy ILLUSTRATORS, man!

Illustrate a scary ten foot tall monstrous mutant cricket and let it hunt some writers down across the forum in absolute terrifying silence!


[traditional]

[Yinny]

Resurrecting this thread from 2015 to see if there are any fellow illustrators still around.
I'm new to the competition and was wondering if anyone knows what the usual procedure for notifying artists of their results is.
There is a lot of information for the writers' competition, but I can't find much about the art side. Any advice/insight would be very helpful!