Discussion: Q4 Volume 36

[Michael Kingswood]

I'm in.

The blessing of doing a story-a-week challenge is you accumulate a lot of properties quickly (I'm 11 weeks in and haven't missed a deadline yet). The curse of doing a story-a-week challenge is you write several that you think would be great to send to WotF...but then you have to wait 2 months to submit just one of them.

*sigh*

Poor me. Poor me.



Good luck, everybody!

[Helge Mahrt]

I'm in.

The blessing of doing a story-a-week challenge is you accumulate a lot of properties quickly (I'm 11 weeks in and haven't missed a deadline yet). The curse of doing a story-a-week challenge is you write several that you think would be great to send to WotF...but then you have to wait 2 months to submit just one of them.

*sigh*

Poor me. Poor me.



Good luck, everybody!

Doing your own or doing Dean's? Awesome either way!

[Michael Kingswood]

I'm in.

The blessing of doing a story-a-week challenge is you accumulate a lot of properties quickly (I'm 11 weeks in and haven't missed a deadline yet). The curse of doing a story-a-week challenge is you write several that you think would be great to send to WotF...but then you have to wait 2 months to submit just one of them.

*sigh*

Poor me. Poor me.



Good luck, everybody!

Doing your own or doing Dean's? Awesome either way!

Dean's. I go to a lot of his Vegas and online workshops and I needed to kick myself in the tushy after a couple bad writing years, so I figured what the heck. Get myself a Lifetime pass out of it, or at least get a lot of stories done.

[JVAshley]

A story a week!
Michael you left those two years of bad writing and jumped back in with a vengeance! Congrats!

[Wulf Moon]

Dean Wesley Smith is the king of write fast, don't revise, and don't look back. I consider his book on Heinleins Rules a must read. What's this challenge he gave you guys?

[Michael Kingswood]

Dean Wesley Smith is the king of write fast, don't revise, and don't look back. I consider his book on Heinleins Rules a must read. What's this challenge he gave you guys?

It's called The Great Challenge. Details at the link.

[tkunit]

Dean Wesley Smith is the king of write fast, don't revise, and don't look back. I consider his book on Heinleins Rules a must read. What's this challenge he gave you guys?

It's called The Great Challenge. Details at the link.

I think I'm going to sign up for this - it's the kick in the behind I need.

[Michael Kingswood]

Dean Wesley Smith is the king of write fast, don't revise, and don't look back. I consider his book on Heinleins Rules a must read. What's this challenge he gave you guys?

It's called The Great Challenge. Details at the link.

I think I'm going to sign up for this - it's the kick in the behind I need.

Good. Go for it!

It's been a ton of fun. :)

[tkunit]

Good. Go for it!

It's been a ton of fun. :)

Oh, I just signed up for it. Thanks for the recommendation.

[Helge Mahrt]

Awesome stuff! I wanted to sign up, but with my toddler it's hard to stay on such a tight schedule. Maybe next year

[chuckt]

Oh man. Wow. What a great challenge. Get a story critiqued every week by Dean. 2000 word minimum though. That'd be tough to do and maintain the day job.

[RSchibler]

Awesome stuff! I wanted to sign up, but with my toddler it's hard to stay on such a tight schedule. Maybe next year

I tried to do this last fall on my own (at the same time I had started a novel) and with kids, it was just too much. I'd love to do it someday, if I'm ever not working on a book and/or raising tiny people.

[WriterGirl0426]

Tracy: Sounds interesting to me. I'd say go for it. Just be sure that speculative element shows up swiftly. (That info might be vague enough to keep you anonymous, but it still might be good to pare it down.)

Thanks D! Good advice. The spec element definitely come up quickly. Within the first 250 words. I also went back and took any possible key words out of my post. Just to be safe. :)

[Helge Mahrt]

Awesome stuff! I wanted to sign up, but with my toddler it's hard to stay on such a tight schedule. Maybe next year

I tried to do this last fall on my own (at the same time I had started a novel) and with kids, it was just too much. I'd love to do it someday, if I'm ever not working on a book and/or raising tiny people.

Same here. I was like: before committing the money, I'll prove to myself that I'm able to keep up. And well... the result has been the same for me.

[JVAshley]

I'd love to do it someday, if I'm ever not working on a book and/or raising tiny people.

Exactly this, although I have to admit my tiny people aren't quite as tiny any more, but they still require tons of attention of one kind or other. But Dean's contest sounds soooo tempting. I just have to keep chanting, "You have a book to edit." And then get back to work.

[Wulf Moon]

Oh man. Wow. What a great challenge. Get a story critiqued every week by Dean. 2000 word minimum though. That'd be tough to do and maintain the day job.

Chuck, replying to you, but of course, sharing with all. Dean Wesley Smith was my mentor, and the reason I'm writing--and selling--again today. His teachings on getting your words on paper, not rewriting, and always looking forward by moving on to the next are the foundation of my Super Secret Bonus Challenge. Four original fresh stories in one contest year is not an impossible goal. It's a simple start toward growth, and all new writers need to start somewhere, set reasonable goals that push themselves, and keep moving forward in their skills. In truth, most of us need to be writing much, much more.

So this is a great challenge. Actually, it's teaching you to reach a level many pro writers are writing at: a chapter a week, or a short story a week. 1,000 words a day equals 7,000 words a week. That's a meaty novel chapter. And a nice size for a decent short story.

I used to do a similar challenge with my writing partner, back in my Wordos days in Eugene, Oregon, where I became friends with Dean and Kris. We'd meet for lunch once a week at East 19th McMennamins Pub. I'd hand my writing partner my completed novel chapter for the week, and he'd hand me his. Then, we'd go over our critique on the chapter we submitted the prior week.

It was amazing how much you got written when you knew you had to account to someone every week. Physically meeting for lunch helped as well--you didn't want to be the one to come empty handed. (You might even want to say the person that comes empty handed has to buy!) Even on bad weeks, I discovered I could punch out a zippy chapter in very little time so I wouldn't come empty handed. Challenges like this are very motivating.

And now, my caveat. As always, it's just an opinion--I am a firm believer in listening to advice, figuring out if it's valid in your case, and then doing what is right for you. But if you're trying to win Writers of the Future, you might very well wish to invest more than a week on your winning story. Almost all the winners put a great deal of time into their winning stories--some, in fact, worked on them for many years (I don't recommend this, but success is hard to argue with). Yeah, I wrote my winning story in 36 hours, but I'm sure my subconscious had been ruminating on that little 250 word flash piece it was based on for many months. My point is, if you get a strong idea that needs time to work on, being divided between meeting a weekly challenge or creating your magnum opus for WotF can create a real conflict. You might have to choose between rushing to meet your weekly deadline, or spending more time to research and flesh out a story for WotF that will need more than a week to finish.

Personally--(Yoda voice: Away with your weapons, I mean you no harm)--I wouldn't put myself under a challenge that might force me to focus on the challenge over my WotF winner. If you sense you have a truly great story on your hands, you should take all the time necessary to make it right. It's how you win this contest. Ask the winners.

Then again, someone could argue that creating fresh stories every week will uncover that true gold nugget. Or teach you the skills necessary to write that true gold nugget. This is a good thing! So I will simply say if you are in a challenge and discover that has happened, drop the challenge temporarily and create your winner. If you are doing the challenge with a friend, they will understand. If you're doing it with Dean, he'll start you over if you miss.

Your focus determines your reality. Since you are here, I assume you are here to write well, and to win this contest. Be sure you can handle any commitments you make, and that said commitments won't distract or interfere with giving your quarterly entry the 100 percent focus it will need to win.

All the beast,

Wulf Moon

[glenn84]

Oh man. Wow. What a great challenge. Get a story critiqued every week by Dean. 2000 word minimum though. That'd be tough to do and maintain the day job.

Chuck, replying to you, but of course, sharing with all. Dean Wesley Smith was my mentor, and the reason I'm writing--and selling--again today. His teachings on getting your words on paper, not rewriting, and always looking forward by moving on to the next are the foundation of my Super Secret Bonus Challenge. Four original fresh stories in one contest year is not an impossible goal. It's a simple start toward growth, and all new writers need to start somewhere, set reasonable goals that push themselves, and keep moving forward in their skills. In truth, most of us need to be writing much, much more.

So this is a great challenge. Actually, it's teaching you to reach a level many pro writers are writing at: a chapter a week, or a short story a week. 1,000 words a day equals 7,000 words a week. That's a meaty novel chapter. And a nice size for a decent short story.

I used to do a similar challenge with my writing partner, back in my Wordos days in Eugene, Oregon, where I became friends with Dean and Kris. We'd meet for lunch once a week at East 19th McMennamins Pub. I'd hand my writing partner my completed novel chapter for the week, and he'd hand me his. Then, we'd go over our critique on the chapter we submitted the prior week.

It was amazing how much you got written when you knew you had to account to someone every week. Physically meeting for lunch helped as well--you didn't want to be the one to come empty handed. (You might even want to say the person that comes empty handed has to buy!) Even on bad weeks, I discovered I could punch out a zippy chapter in very little time so I wouldn't come empty handed. Challenges like this are very motivating.

And now, my caveat. As always, it's just an opinion--I am a firm believer in listening to advice, figuring out if it's valid in your case, and then doing what is right for you. But if you're trying to win Writers of the Future, you might very well wish to invest more than a week on your winning story. Almost all the winners put a great deal of time into their winning stories--some, in fact, worked on them for many years (I don't recommend this, but success is hard to argue with). Yeah, I wrote my winning story in 36 hours, but I'm sure my subconscious had been ruminating on that little 250 word flash piece it was based on for many months. My point is, if you get a strong idea that needs time to work on, being divided between meeting a weekly challenge or creating your magnum opus for WotF can create a real conflict. You might have to choose between rushing to meet your weekly deadline, or spending more time to research and flesh out a story for WotF that will need more than a week to finish.

Personally--(Yoda voice: Away with your weapons, I mean you no harm)--I wouldn't put myself under a challenge that might force me to focus on the challenge over my WotF winner. If you sense you have a truly great story on your hands, you should take all the time necessary to make it right. It's how you win this contest. Ask the winners.

Then again, someone could argue that creating fresh stories every week will uncover that true gold nugget. Or teach you the skills necessary to write that true gold nugget. This is a good thing! So I will simply say if you are in a challenge and discover that has happened, drop the challenge temporarily and create your winner. If you are doing the challenge with a friend, they will understand. If you're doing it with Dean, he'll start you over if you miss.

Your focus determines your reality. Since you are here, I assume you are here to write well, and to win this contest. Be sure you can handle any commitments you make, and that said commitments won't distract or interfere with giving your quarterly entry the 100 percent focus it will need to win.

All the beast,

Wulf Moon

Very good advice, Wulf! I've been following a similar path myself. Halfway through my second novel while hacking my first (good) one into literal pieces. Writing (attempting to anyway) a new story every quarter while working full time and attending graduate school. Every now and then I'll go back to my HMs with fresher eyes. Long story short, it's a learning process, just like anything else worth pursuing in life.

[Michael Kingswood]

If you're doing it with Dean, he'll start you over if you miss.

Agree with most of your points, Wulf, but I must raise one point of order. In this week's story prompt Dean advised that if we consistently get the same comments from him about a certain problem he sees in our stories, and he's got a workshop to help with it, that we should consider pausing the challenge, do the workshop, then restart. So though by the rules of the Challenge it's miss a week and you gotta rebuy if you want to start over, his primary focus is always on learning and it sounds like he'll allow a bit of flexion for the sake of such learning. But that'd be something to work out between the challengee and him; don't take my word for it.

Same here. I was like: before committing the money, I'll prove to myself that I'm able to keep up. And well... the result has been the same for me.

Not trying to be judgy. But consider that without skin in the game it is much easier to allow oneself to slack on a goal or project. That's why I like this challenge - I've put $ on the table and there are real stakes to blowing it. And a financial upside - a pretty good financial upside when you consider what he and Kris charge for their lifetime memberships - to following through and rocking it.

So maybe you really should be doing the opposite of what you said here - throwing $ down before you know you can do it, to force yourself to make it happen. (no I don't get any kickbacks from Dean. And I'm not trying to tell you what to do with your money. I'm strictly talking from a philosophical perspective) Patton said, "A good plan today is better than a perfect plan tomorrow." Bold and timely action reaps benefits. If throwing $ at this thing isn't your speed, cool, but find some other way to give yourself incentives to perform and consequences if you don't.

Skin in the game - it ain't just the title of a great book.

(and seriously, if you guys haven't read Nassim Nicholas Taleb's books - all of them - you really ought to. Brilliant man, and very insightful.)


V/R,
Michael

[disgruntledpeony]

Four original fresh stories in one contest year is not an impossible goal. It's a simple start toward growth, and all new writers need to start somewhere, set reasonable goals that push themselves, and keep moving forward in their skills. In truth, most of us need to be writing much, much more.

Important caveat: in order to write more that much, one needs to have the free time available to invest in such an action.

Not trying to be judgy. But consider that without skin in the game it is much easier to allow oneself to slack on a goal or project. That's why I like this challenge - I've put $ on the table and there are real stakes to blowing it. And a financial upside - a pretty good financial upside when you consider what he and Kris charge for their lifetime memberships - to following through and rocking it.

So maybe you really should be doing the opposite of what you said here - throwing $ down before you know you can do it, to force yourself to make it happen. (no I don't get any kickbacks from Dean. And I'm not trying to tell you what to do with your money. I'm strictly talking from a philosophical perspective) Patton said, "A good plan today is better than a perfect plan tomorrow." Bold and timely action reaps benefits. If throwing $ at this thing isn't your speed, cool, but find some other way to give yourself incentives to perform and consequences if you don't.

I can't speak for everyone here, but I've never been able to afford any kind of writing workshop. I've made do with how-to books and practice, thus far. I'm glad you're able to invest the time and money into such a course, but it's important to remember that an ever-increasing number of people these days quite literally can't.

[Michael Kingswood]

I can't speak for everyone here, but I've never been able to afford any kind of writing workshop. I've made do with how-to books and practice, thus far. I'm glad you're able to invest the time and money into such a course, but it's important to remember that an ever-increasing number of people these days quite literally can't.

Oh, 100% understand that, and agree. Hence my "I'm talking philosophical" caveat. There are other ways to add skin in the game, incentives, and consequences.

[disgruntledpeony]

I can't speak for everyone here, but I've never been able to afford any kind of writing workshop. I've made do with how-to books and practice, thus far. I'm glad you're able to invest the time and money into such a course, but it's important to remember that an ever-increasing number of people these days quite literally can't.

Oh, 100% understand that, and agree. Hence my "I'm talking philosophical" caveat. There are other ways to add skin in the game, incentives, and consequences.

Trust me, I get that. My skin, as it were, is honestly the twins. I want to be able to help provide for them financially, but I'm a stay at home mom by necessity at the moment, so writing is my outlet/hope for bringing a little extra cash into the household.

[glenn84]

Four original fresh stories in one contest year is not an impossible goal. It's a simple start toward growth, and all new writers need to start somewhere, set reasonable goals that push themselves, and keep moving forward in their skills. In truth, most of us need to be writing much, much more.

Important caveat: in order to write more that much, one needs to have the free time available to invest in such an action.

Not trying to be judgy. But consider that without skin in the game it is much easier to allow oneself to slack on a goal or project. That's why I like this challenge - I've put $ on the table and there are real stakes to blowing it. And a financial upside - a pretty good financial upside when you consider what he and Kris charge for their lifetime memberships - to following through and rocking it.

So maybe you really should be doing the opposite of what you said here - throwing $ down before you know you can do it, to force yourself to make it happen. (no I don't get any kickbacks from Dean. And I'm not trying to tell you what to do with your money. I'm strictly talking from a philosophical perspective) Patton said, "A good plan today is better than a perfect plan tomorrow." Bold and timely action reaps benefits. If throwing $ at this thing isn't your speed, cool, but find some other way to give yourself incentives to perform and consequences if you don't.

I can't speak for everyone here, but I've never been able to afford any kind of writing workshop. I've made do with how-to books and practice, thus far. I'm glad you're able to invest the time and money into such a course, but it's important to remember that an ever-increasing number of people these days quite literally can't.

It's amazing the way that works huh? You would think that with all the technology we have life would be simpler. Nope. I'm here paying $1,400 a month for a 400 square foot studio in San Diego. Every little penny I earn pays some kind of bill. It's hard enough for a bachelor. I can't imagine for someone who has kids like you disgruntled. I have nightmares thinking about what I would do if I ever got that call from the lady.

[WriterGirl0426]

I can't speak for everyone here, but I've never been able to afford any kind of writing workshop. I've made do with how-to books and practice, thus far. I'm glad you're able to invest the time and money into such a course, but it's important to remember that an ever-increasing number of people these days quite literally can't.

My skin, as it were, is honestly the twins. I want to be able to help provide for them financially, but I'm a stay at home mom by necessity at the moment, so writing is my outlet/hope for bringing a little extra cash into the household.

I went back and forth on chiming in on this thread, but decided I have to, since I'm so in this boat. There are so many monetary demands on writers trying to make it professionally, and workshops aren't the only expenses. Memberships, conferences, and even most contests and awards require money. Not to mention the costs of marketing. The costs require a careful eye to what's critical vs. nice-to-have. Especially for those of us living paycheck to paycheck.

Starving artist indeed.

[Michael Kingswood]

It's amazing the way that works huh? You would think that with all the technology we have life would be simpler. Nope. I'm here paying $1,400 a month for a 400 square foot studio in San Diego. Every little penny I earn pays some kind of bill. It's hard enough for a bachelor. I can't imagine for someone who has kids like you disgruntled. I have nightmares thinking about what I would do if I ever got that call from the lady.

You're in San Diego too? Hello, neighbor! Dunno about you, but I'm busily plotting my escape from CA as we speak.

Hard to do with an ex-wife who refuses to leave and 4 kids you wanna be Dad to. But nothing worthwhile is easy. And I can't think of anything more worthwhile for a patriotic American (or really anyone with economic sanity) than to get the hell out of CA.

Vegas, here I come! In a year or so.

Meanwhile, let's grab a beer sometime, eh?

[LDWriter2]

I know what story I will be using, unless of course something else comes to mind. Never know when my muse strikes. This story is done and will have time to have it looked over and then "fixed" in plenty of time.

[Corbin Maxwell]

Submitted my Q3 this morning. My Q4 turned into a book. I’m at 20k with a ship-load of material still to write.

[disgruntledpeony]

Submitted my Q3 this morning. My Q4 turned into a book. I’m at 20k with a ship-load of material still to write.

You submitted your Q4 instead of your Q3, if you submitted it this morning. Q3 ended on June 30th.

[Corbin Maxwell]

Submitted my Q3 this morning. My Q4 turned into a book. I’m at 20k with a ship-load of material still to write.

You submitted your Q4 instead of your Q3, if you submitted it this morning. Q3 ended on June 30th.

I guess I’m confused. It comes with the brain damage. Then I guess my other entry was for Q3. Hmmmm.

[Corbin Maxwell]

I submitted one in April and I guess I let the whole Q3 go by. I meant to submit to Q3. But I guess I got confused.

This stuff happens to me all the time now.

[disgruntledpeony]

Submitted my Q3 this morning. My Q4 turned into a book. I’m at 20k with a ship-load of material still to write.

You submitted your Q4 instead of your Q3, if you submitted it this morning. Q3 ended on June 30th.

I guess I’m confused. It comes with the brain damage. Then I guess my other entry was for Q3. Hmmmm.

No worries, it's all good. I just wanted to clarify so you wouldn't accidentally submit twice to the same quarter. Q1 is October 1st - December 31st. Q2 is January 1st - March 31st. Q3 is April 1st - June 30th. Q4 is July 1st - September 30th.